Wednesday, April 14, 2010


Another thing that's been on my mind-
When is a person too good? Too sweet? Giving up what they want for others? It's a fine line between being selfish and selfless, but being selfless isn't necessarily the best way to go.

If you give up what you truely want for the sake of others, where will that get YOUR life? Also, if you constantly remind everyone of what an amazing person you are, and how selfless you are and how much you do for the world around you, doesn't that defeat the purpose of being a good person? it seems to undermine it all.

I'm all for someone doing everything they can to help the world around them, but on notes similar to things I've said in the past, how much is too much? What you do can impact the world and help those around you, but make sure it doesn't come at your own cost. I have always struggled with people calling me selfish, especially after coming out, but I know that there are certain things that a person must do for themselves. If you see someone helping someone else at their own sake, try to point this out to them- because the world will not become a better place if one person succeeds while the other one fails. Make sure you have a clear perception of who you are and where you're going before you help everybody else. Be a little selfish sometimes.


  1. As long as its within the realm of halacha... and orthodox tradition (unfortunately that has to be highlighted this day and age) then do whatever the hell is going to make you a fulfilled and happy human being. Do not look at others... do not look at your background or surroundings... help others but dont let it drag you down! In order to succeed in life, you have to have a certain ego and level of selfishness. Dont be afraid to live the life YOU want to! Dont be afraid to take steps that will get you to a place YOU want to be! The last thing you want is to have regrets at 120.
    Helping others will follow. Once people see that your happy in life, they will attach themselves to you and look for guidance. All it takes is a sense of purpose and the peace of mind knowing that you chose a path for yourself and will do no matter what to achieve your goals. Family.. friends... everyone will respect you a lot more when you do what you want to no matter what the social or cultural consequences are! Religious consequences are different but even that is between you and God! Be free... accomplish whatever you want in life and dont let anyone or anything stand in your way!

  2. in other words--you are trying to find a balance between "bishvili nivra haolam" and "anochi afar vo-ayfair", i.e.--how much do you count?
    please let me know when u find the correct answer!

  3. you are so mentally messed up. you should seek professional help, ely. like before you do something dangerous.

  4. and by the way, it does say in the torah that its a sin to be gay. it says it in musaf davening for yom kippur. thats how big the sin is, thats its in a tefillah on yom kippur!

  5. Congrats, anon, you succeeded in hurting me. But until you are in the position that I am, until you know the struggle and pain and tears, I don't feel you have the right to tell me how to live my life.

  6. do u mind telling me your name, the person who posted this blog?

  7. I think it's a matter of understanding what the "self" is. You know the friends episode where there is no such thing as a selfless good deed? Right? Even if you don't go around telling everybody what a good person you are, you are still going to feel amazing, and so what you do for others, you are actually doing for yourself.

    It is impossible to be selfless. Does that mean that it is impossible to be good? No.

    Why? Because it all depends on what your conception of self. If serving yourself makes you happy, you are selfish, and "evil". However, if other people are included in your sense of self - if you have a close friend, or family member whom you love so much that you care about that person as much as you care about yourself, you have really just expanded your sense of self to include that person. That's why you may want to give your life for someone else, why you daven for them, why you do for them. That's the meaning of v'ahavta l'reacha kamocha - it's not love people so much, it's not love people and see yourself as trash, it's love people as much as you love yourself.

    I'd venture to say that you can only love someone to the extent to which you love yourself. If V'ahavta l'reacha kamocha - kamocha. The more you love yourself and the more you expand your definition of self outward, the more powerful you are and the more beautiful your relationships become.

    Just to comment on what DB said - Halacha is not the only part of our religion. It is a baseline. There are positive commandments - and I suppose you can classify those under "halacha" but we have many chovot on our lev - there are perspectives that we are obligated to build, emotions we are obligated to feel, and to weild. And if we apply this idea to our religion life in general. Hashem is one, echad, i the sense of achdut - He is all - our religious work should be about extending our sense of self to include everyone and everything so that our wills are perfectly aligned with God, and that we unite the world under that banner.

    But yea - I had a Rebbe who once said that your cup can only flow over if it is fully filled. You've gotta be independent before you can really help others, otherwise, you will definitely be dependent, even when you help others. But if you stop at independent growth, you are just as selfish.

  8. u can contact me privately, ...

  9. This past week's Perek in Pirkei Avos told us "Al tadun es chavercha ad shtagiya limkomo." Nobody should judge you, Ely, besides yourself and God. Most of us (Mr. Anonymous excluded, I'm guessing) are just trying to understand your mikokmo.

  10. simchas beis hatoaivaApril 18, 2010 at 1:38 PM

    I hear what paint is saying - ely can you please clearly in one or two lines define the "position" your in.

    I think that will help many of us understand where you're coming from.

  11. I think you are a courageous human being. I believe hashem will guide you and you will find peace with all of this. You are not wrong for having these feelings. This is how G-d created you. I hope you find a loving relationship and stay frum. Your challenge is not that you are gay. It is to believe that G-d loves you and it is ok to live your life authentically and be observant despite what others think. Hopefully you can find an accepting and compassionate community.

  12. okay there are many anonymous' but i am the one who asked ur name. apparently it is ely... do u mind me asking what ur last name is?

  13. never mind just checked your profile and found out.

  14. Be successful in business, make a lot of money, give cash to "moisdois" and they'll honor you - as long as you are shomer Shabbos.

    If homosexuality was everyone's preoccupation sin we'd be mentioning it every day, no? Our confessional on Yom hadin is for the collective. We are an organic whole, more than the sum of our collective parts and certainly greater than any individual's challenges and transgressions. That's true in a perfect world. Alas, ours is imperfect.

    You'll find your way frumgay in whatever community you choose. By giving of yourself, you won't have to toot your own horn; someone else will toot it for you. In business, selfishness leads to action.

    In all things (those who sit in judgment) there must be a balance.

  15. (new Anonymous here)
    Hi Frumgay,
    I understand your situation. The problem is that we all need other people, relationships, feedback, to know "who we are". But, people around us are just as limited and imperfect as we are. Therefore it's painful to hear people, especially if they're close to you, say that you're selfish, arrogant, etc. It can be very de-stabilizing. Are they right, or do they say this just because there's no way they can deal with who you are?
    Listen to what people you're close with say about you, then do some heshbon hanefesh, and after that it's perfectly legitimate to disagree. No matter how close they are, or how much they love you, or how much you admire them, people can misinterpret you, and think you're being selfish when you aren't; it may reflect on their discomfort more than on your attitude. Im ein ani li, mi li? (etc.)
    You sound like a considerate and thoughtful person, and you know all this. Still, it hurts when people are cruel. Be strong!

  16. (new anonymous also) hi there. just out of curiosity, does your family know about this situation of yours?


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